On Magdalene
From: dottie zold
Date: Thu Mar 18, 2004 7:23 pm
Subject: On Magdalene
Hi Everyone,
I am here again at Magdalenes door.
In reading Mr. Prokofieff I realized that
he as well does not have anything to really say on Magdalene.
What keeps happening within these books is that there are only
two people so noted at the Cross. And that is Mother Mary and
John.
Now, Mr. Prokofieff does not seem to related
John with Lazarus as does not Mr. Schurre. And I find that interesting
again today. So, why is that? Is it they are ignorant of her
and find her not to be important? No, I do not think this is
so. There is something else going on and what I came to again
is this whole Virgin again thing.
To the critics, Diana and Peter, if you are
reading this I just want to say I am looking at this not as a
hard core physical realty rather a certain understanding of what
can happen if there is truly a spirit reality. Now, I am aware
there is as I have had too many experiences and it would be self
denial to act as if these things had not occurred in my life.
Just wanted to say this for some reason. Whatever.
Anyhow, it is said that the Step Mother is
not a purified soul. It is said that she lived through many lives
and had run the gamult of experiences that then led her to this
one at the time of Christ. Now, it is said she was made a virgin
again. What I believe we can surmise is that it is not a physical
sexual virgin rather a purified soul as in the original Mary
who passed away earlier on.
So, once again I keep coming to this point
Bradford. I want to say it to you because I think you can get
what I am trying to come to and you are one who might be able
to see it as well. Maybe not and it is just me. I don't know.
Why do we only have the John disciple and
the Mother mentioned at the cross in these books? Can it really
be as simple that they have not seen the importance of the woman
who annointed Jesus and who stood by him when no others did?
Can it really be as simple as they have not seen the importance
of the woman who shouted out to the world: He Is Risen?
No, I do not think it is this simple,
Dottie
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From: holderlin66
Date: Fri Mar 19, 2004 10:27 am
Subject: Re: On Magdalene
dottie zold wrote:
So, once again I keep coming to this point
Bradford. I want to say it to you because I think you can get
what I am trying to come to and you are one who might be able
to see it as well.
Bradford comments;
The heart wrenching tragedy that Magdalene
experiences is depicted strongly in Grunewald's painting. But
where the heart is so wrenched, (not a state to ride in a wild
roller coaster with, and have cognition be subject to mighty
mood swings) Magadalene's vision is wrenched free to be the first
human being to see the condensation of the Phantom or future
Atma-Spirit Man.
What I have tried to indicate in the CARBON
indications of Steiner's as a rebuilding of Carbon model out
of Light, brings profound understanding to how Christ could eat
bread, be touched, walk, make dinner, and have Thomas feel the
wounds. Here was not merely manifested an Etheric Vision of the
Christ. This is what I have tried to describe, with Steiner's
amazing indications, of a beam me aboard molecular and carbon
based life form, command of the atomic table.
Dottie you may be upset with the lack of research
on Magdalene but I am equally upset by the lack of understanding,
inspiration and quickening of the facts, of how Christ took command
0f the mysterious atomic table. Like you, I suspect that if people
really understood what the Christ Event was, which, even on every
Michael School science discussion, they continue to fail, would
raise the Faith of Christ into the Science of Christ. It really
pisses me off that we seem unable to bring certain rich concepts
together in our brains. I can nearly walk you through the entire
mystery that Steiner understood, as Christ commanding, obviously
commanding matter.
So along with Magdalene seeing - and here
I wish to remind everyone of the mood swing of atavistic vision.
So, so many people I have known keep their emotional life in
tremendous flux because they imagine that by riding these mood
swings and evoking them dysfunctionally and choosing situations
where these mood swings are evoked, that indeed, they can FEEL
life. This isn't life your feeling, it is the selfish assertion
that you are alive. I AM Cognition is different in its center
of stillness against the clutter of mood swing emotionalism.
Magdalene foreshadowed the Washing of the
Feet -
This has profound meaning. But it means that
again, the lumps we call the Michael School fail to really enter
into the richness that Steiner offered. Where my feet go, go
I. Who do I Serve? Will my future destiny, where ever it takes
me, put me eternally in service of the Christ? Are there martydom
and honesty peaks and valleys that we have no idea about? We
don't imagine these intense first hand forerunners as smiling
with a Fundie look of Christian dogma on their faces do we? The
Washing of the Feet by none other than Christ, really baptized
their destinies in an entirely new way in relation to Earth and
the paths they tread. Magdalene foreshadowed this mystery for
Jesus.
Magdalene saw the first shimmering Rainbow/matter
- crystalization, sensitive christialization process, as that
which we never witness, when the butterfly arises with the magnificent
shimmering colors on her wings. Magdalene had the front row seat,
as matter, color, and the Elohim - Spirit Man mystery began shimmering
into solidity as the atomic table congealed before Magdalene's
eyes. "Touch Me Not" If we only had real Anthro's who
really stood firmly and understood the meaning of what was just
said, Science would leap forward. Do we even have 100 Anthros
stunned by what they read in Steiner?
I used to think, Magdalene was the first to
see the Etheric Christ, but this appears to me to be a different
sighting. I have always understood Magdalene as the Venus mystery
of the Endocrine system. This seeing Venus Naked and the accusation
of Magdalene having been caught having an affair and about to
be Stoned... and the Samaritan woman at the Well, with her several
man friends - show that Christ was looking into the depths of
Love and the profound mystery of sexuality and the Endocrine
system without any fundie dogma.
I have always thought that the roots of Love
itself, was why the mystery of Golgotha occurred on Good Friday
or Good Freya's day. This remains true for me, but again, Anthro's
fail to see the powerful mystery of how Christian Rosenkreuz
views Venus Naked, as all that exists as beauty in the world,
yet linked, not only to a shepherd who had the pleasure of sleeping
with Venus.
Aeneas, the son of Anchises and the goddess
Aphrodite, founder of Rome. Who was He? Why did Anchises get
to see Venus Naked?
Magdalene is in polarity to the Mary-Sophia,
so white and as if bloodless in a stroke, stricken beneath the
Cross, from the Grunewald painting. The two together, the vertical
Sophia and the kneeling, passionate Magdalene reveal the complex
mix of what would be termed the combination of the new AnthroSophic
Soul.
To reach the extension of Love that was seen
at the first Spirit Man shimmering that Magdalene saw, we must
tread both areas of Love. That is stillness of I AM cognition
and Emotional stirring and high tuning of the heart. Depth of
the Endocrine system and human passions in the balance. This
high tuning is everything that we call THE ROMANTICS and poets
like Rainer Marie Rilke. This new AnthroSophic soul condition
is what our thinking and the Michael School leads to. Not Robots,
but unique individuals who see the same things in thinking and
in the heart when people speak with Truth.
Mary Magdalene has an ancient Sumerian Inanna
vibe to her. If Holderlin is said to have hoped for the Gold
of the inner Earth and would not stray far from Christ, as others
have indicated, I would think that Magdalene would have remained
close to the very same Gold. She very well could be escort and
comforter on the path of the inner transformation of the Sentient
Soul into Spirit Self. In the Grunewald painting her hair is
wavy, long gold, that full of etheric life, flows downwards to
the earth in a golden shower. [or streams upward from the Earth
and surrounds her head] There is no doubt that Magdalene walked
the walk and talked the talk of the depths of the Sentient Soul.
My shared insights with Spiritual Scientific
basis are the way the eyes might be able to see the Etheric Christ
today because of the model of Magdalenes character in the NT
and at the Resurrection. Love opens the eyes to see lots of things.
Tragedy opens the eyes as well. Our discussion around the catastrophe
of Europe should stun us into thinking just what would have been
the condition of the world if STeiner and German Idealism had
risen to I AM cognition. This is the core of the catastrophe,
the epi-center, and the monsters that arose from the lie and
what they did to humans, goes beyond catastrophe to nightmare.
It was Magdalene's knowledge of what Christ was about to go through
on the Cross, long before the other knuckle headed disciples
had a clue, that made her kneel and oil His Holy Feet.
This leads to a Pisces Imagination.. and I
really don't wish to go through the long process of explaining
that now. But Spiritual Service to the future of the I AM is
indicated.
But we see that in the Last Supper the ability
and the objection of one of the disciples to having his feet
washed, Peter again, is part of the revelation of remaining in
constant contact with the Christ in the future etheric field
where ever their incarnations and destiny shall take them. These
incarnations lead from the Last Supper to the Grail and Arthurian
communities and the Cathars, to current Michael School Seekers.
Those washed feet and the destinies of REAL
individuals remained in destiny contact, foot by foot and mile
by mile with the direction of the Christ Being. Their feet became
Spiritual compass points. Let me repeat that for those who cannot
see concepts as they glide by their eyes, THEIR FEET BECAME SPIRITUAL
COMPASS POINTERS FOR THE CHRIST. That is a Spiritual Scientific,
geographic and incarnational research project that leads to the
western direction of the Grail families and to the current School
of Michael and those gathered now in I AM Cognition training.
Who really brought The Washing of the Feet to the fore and who
saw the Christ first with Love saturated etheric vision as the
Christ condensed and commanded the atomic table to his needs,
was Mary Magdalene.
Dottie and I agree, to a certain degree, but
learning to see what Magdalene would learn to prove, like Corelli,
advances Magdalene from someone serving our selfish mood swings,
to someone who hovers over the whole of the 5th Post Atlantean
epoch and lives deeply into the science of the endocrine system,
Reproductive Technology, cloning divorced from love; and the
highest vision of matter and science that Magdalene witnessed
with her own eyes. Christ commanding, at the instant, the atomic
table.
There is no conclusion to this. For all I
can say, Marie Corelli would have the capacity to be, what we
expect of the future Magdalene. But of this, I have no facts.
I can only admire the depth and compare my inner notes. Magdalene
initiated the Pisces service of uncovering the mystery of destiny.
For Destiny and the Fishes are also what humanity studies in
this the 5th Post Atlantean epoch. Nothing happens by accident,
even if it appears accidental. We see wisdom written in every
aspect of our destiny we just must not deny wonder.
Magdalene was ground zero of all that the
Sentient Soul can get mixed up in from Porn to Devotion. Those
wallowing unconsciously with big crosses on their necks, suspect
that if they go down enough it will eventually look like up,
they will eventually come up with a vision of Christ, like Magdalene.
These are Sentient Soul mysteries based on self destruction and
dysfunction. I AM cognition is in that pale Stillness, where
the I AM lives in Cognition.. That is that the I AM sees Thoughts
and sees things that the I AM begins to recognize and build a
solid understanding from it's learning, of the Spiritual World
and its contents. This unities with the Education of the Human
Heart.
Bradford
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From: eyecueco
Date: Sat Mar 20, 2004 8:58 am
Subject: Re: On Magdalene
--- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com,
holderlin66 wrote:
Bradford comments;
I used to think, Magdalene was the first
to see the Etheric Christ, but this appears to me to be a different
sighting. I have always understood Magdalene as the Venus mystery
of the Endocrine system. This seeing Venus Naked and the accusation
of Magdalene having been caught having an affair and about to
be Stoned... and the Samaritan woman at the Well, with her several
man friends - show that Christ was looking into the depths of
Love and the profound mystery of sexuality and the Endocrine
system without any fundie dogma.
Totally in agreement with you about the differnet
kind of sighting experienced by MM. The first to see the Etheric
Christ was Paul.
I also strongly agreee with you that the woman
at the well was MM, and that she was Samarian, as was Lazarus
and Martha. Very important to get this in order to understand
the political climate of that time.
Not so sure about her being the woman to be
stoned. Given her high social standing and wealth and connection
to her people it is possible that her sexual activity was linked
to temple ritual which would have been seen as anathma to the
jews.
Really excellent post, Brad.
Enjoyed it.
Paulina
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From: dottie zold
Date: Sun Mar 21, 2004 11:28 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: On Magdalene
Bradford:
Dottie you may be upset with the lack of
research on Magdalene but I am equally upset by the lack of understanding,
inspiration and quickening of the facts, of how Christ took command
0f the mysterious atomic table.
Dearest Bradford,
It is hard for me to contemplate the atomic
table as you have often talked about. And I have taken this week
to let it roll through me and continue to do so. Thank you for
the great heartening post. It gives a lot of food for thought.
I am wondering if you might take the time
to share your understanding of what was different between the
Paul sighting, if it was indeed a sighting and not a hearing/sight
in the way of Moses, and that of Magdalene. Paulina mentioned
something about this and I am wondering Paulina, how you hold
this as well.
Much love to everyone,
Dottie
...................................................................................................................................
From: dottie zold
Date: Sun Mar 21, 2004 3:45 pm
Subject: Re: On Magdalene
Happy Sunday Everyone,
In looking to understand Paulinas thought
about Paul being the first to see Christ in the etheric I found
my self going through the Mary passages again and then checking
out Pauls conversion. It does indeed seem they do experience
Christ seen differently.
I was a bit surprised to find something in
Mark as if I had never seen it before in the same manner. So
I want to share the various Mary passages from the NT. I find
it interesting that the only place the Mother of Mary was mentioned
was in John. I believe that may be because of the grasping of
the fact that the 'original' Mother was intermingled with the
Mary at the bottom of the cross. And again this leads me back
to my thoughts on Magdalene and the Mother. I will check out
later the paintings of the three Marys: and when I say the three
Marys I mean the Nathan Mary, Solomon Mary, and the Magdalene.
And I will have to check again what the names
of the second Mary's children are. It seems they had been hidden
for so long by the clergy that I do not have them in my thoughts.
But I do believe their were at least two boys, one named James,
and a young girl whose name I am not sure of at this time. If
anyone can post them before I have to go crazy looking for them
I would appreciate it.
Mark: 15:40
40: There were also women
looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary
the 'mother' of James the less and of Joses, and Salome,
41: (Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered
unto him;) and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.
42: And now when the even
was come, because it was the preperation , that is, the day before
the Sabbath,
43: Joseph of Arimathea, an honorable counsellor, which also
waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto
Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
44: And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling
unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any
while dead.
45: And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to
Joseph.
46: And he bought find linen, and took him down, and wrapped
him in the linen and ladi him in a sepulchre which was hewn out
of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
47: And Mary Magdalene and
Mary the 'mother' of Joses beheld where he was laid.
D: (my seperations of lines between 41 and
42 and then 46 and 47)
16:1 AND when the sabbath
was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the 'mother' of James, and
Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might annoint him.
2: And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they
came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.
3: And they said among themselves. Who shall roll us away the
stone from the door of the sepulchre?
4: And when they looked they saw that the stone was rolled away:
for it was very great.
5: And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting
on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they
were affrightened.
6: And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of
Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold
the place where they laid him.
7: But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth
before you into Galilee: there shall ye se him, as he said unto
you.
8: And they went out quicklyi, and fled from the sepulchre; for
they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to
any man; for they were afraid.
9: Now, when Jesus was risen
early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene,
out of whom he had cast seven devils.
10: And she went and told them that had been with him, as they
mourned and wept.
11: And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had
been seen of her, believed not.
12: After that he appered in another form unto two of them, as
they walked, and went into the country.
13: And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed
they them.
14: Afterward, he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat,
and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart,
because they believed not them which had seen him after he was
risen.
Dottie:
I stop here because I have way passed my point
of departure which was the three Marys. What we see here very
clearly is a mystery of the Marys. First we have no Mother Mary
as we know her to be stated, second we have this Mary mother
of James, Joses and Salome. Each time this mother is mentioned
the word mother is italicized. And an interesting point is that
in the last scripture of 15: the Mary mother is noted as the
mother of Joses, and then in 16:1 she is noted as the mother
of James and Salome. There is a specific reason for this although
I do not know it as of yet. If anyone else has a though towards
it other than it just happens to be this way I would like to
hear it.
Now, moving on to Mathew. In here we have
a reference to 'that other Mary' that I think is significant.
Mathew 27:54
54: Now when the centurion,
and they that were with him, watching Jesus saw the earthquake,
and those things that were done, they feared greatly saying,
Truly this was the Son of God.
55: And many women were there
beholding afar off, which followed Jesus from Galilee, minstering
unto him:
56: Among which was Mary Magdalene, and Marth the mother of James
and Hoses, and the mother of Zebeedees children.
...
61: And there was Mary Magdalene, and the other Mary, sitting
over against the sepulchre.
28:
1: In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the
first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary
to see the sepulchre.
Dottie:
So, who is this other Mary? I think it is
high time to figure these things out versus just leaving them
as threads with no connecting weave. In John we have Magdalene
going by herself to the sepulchre. And what can we say about
the three other gospels not having the 'Mother' Mary at the cross?
And if we look further what does it mean that in each of the
other gospels we have Magdalene as the prominent one at the cross
and the ressurection as it is she that is pointed to more than
any other and in fact no other disciple mentioned either.
My thoughts,
Dottie
...................................................................................................................................
From: eyecueco
Date: Sun Mar 21, 2004 3:52 pm
Subject: Re: On Magdalene
--- In anthroposophy_tomorrow@yahoogroups.com,
dottie zold wrote:
I am wondering if you might take the time
to share your understanding of what was different between the
Paul sighting, if it was indeed a sighting and not a hearing/sight
in the way of Moses, and that of Magdalene. Paulina mentioned
something about this and I am wondering Paulina, how you hold
this as well.
The Magdalene, as Brad has explained, depicts
an initiation experience of the Sentient Soul path, where as
the Etheric Christ is essentially an experience for the time
of Consciousness Soul.
You have to factor in the symbolism standing
behind the number seven and the term demons, but, I'm not up
to writing much about this right now as I've been in and out
of hospitals and emergency rooms since the 11th and not yet on
my feet, nor my head cleared of all the horrible meds, but, in
brief, in the ancient mysteries prostitution was part of a sacred
role in certain initiations and given that MM was a Samaritan
you might want to look further into the possibility that she
represents a redeemption of the old stream of things which had,
by the time of Christ fallen into decline and decadence.
Then, there is also the aspect of MM having
to do with being a kind of archetypal representative of the fallen
etheric forces.
Steiner spoke about the ancient Mothers as
being personifications of pure life force in different aspect
as originated on Ancient Saturn, Ancient Sun and Ancient Moon.
Anthroposophic writer, Sylvia Franke, says that the Greeks saw
a picture of these ancient forces in their goddesses, Rhea, Demeter
and Persephone.
If you will think on the Greek myth of Persephone,
and then think on how the Risen Christ was just returning from
the sub-spheres you will get a better picture of what played
out in the vision MM had at the tomb and why MM saw Him as a
gardener; i.e., tied to the earth forces.
Whereas with Paul you have to factor in both
what he was invovled in, sect wise and also when his vision occurred.
At the tomb when the Christ was re-ascending from the sub-spheres
where He had freed the souls of the dead He was only in the region
of the earth forces. When Paul experienced his visionthe Etheric
Christ was already beginning his outward bound portion of his
two thousand year etheric journey to the edge of the solar system
and back.
MM's vision is more tied to the earth forces,
Paul's to the etheric.
This is the best I can do at the moment. If
it doesn't work for you I'll try again at a later date when feeling
better.
Paulina
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From: dottie zold
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:55 am
Subject: Re: On Magdalene
Paulina:
This is the best I can do at the moment.
If it doesn't work for you I'll try again at a later date when
feeling better.
Dear Paulina,
I am glad to hear you are at home and on the
mend. I am thinking on your writings above which is why I have
not written. I would like to say however I really wish we had
some kind of note passed onto us when dear listmates are illin
and so forth. I never liked the idea of just not hearing from
one again and not knowing at various times what has happened.
At times when I did not hear from you on another
list I worried something had happened and we would not know.
I felt the same for Catherine. Maybe we can come up with a family
plan of sorts where we ask our love ones to notify the group.
Sounds a little strange maybe but it has been on my mind for
quite some times. I would get a thought about you or Lex or someone
and damn if I didn't hear later that this was happening. Same
thing this time and a few months back.
Love and good health to you,
Dottie
...................................................................................................................................
From: holderlin66
Date: Tue Apr 6, 2004 6:44 pm
Subject: On Magdalene/ Reviewing the Linen cloth
"The two ran side by
side, and the other disciple ran ahead of (and) faster than Peter
and came first to the grave, 5 and, having bent down, he saw
the (burial) linen strips lying (there), but he did not enter.
6 Then, Simon Peter also came, following (the other disciple),
and he entered the tomb and saw the (burial) linen strips lying
(there) 7 and the cloth piece which was on his head, not with
the linen strips lying (there), but having been tied up separately
in one place."
holderlin wrote:
Bradford comments;
Magadalene's vision is wrenched free to
be the first human being to see the condensation of the Phantom
or future Atma-Spirit Man.
What I have tried to indicate in the CARBON
indications of Steiner's as a rebuilding of Carbon model out
of Light, brings profound understanding to how Christ could eat
bread, be touched, walk, make dinner, and have Thomas feel the
wounds. Here was not merely manifested an Etheric Vision of the
Christ. This is what I have tried to describe, with Steiner's
amazing indications, of a beam me aboard molecular and carbon
based life form, command of the atomic table.
I can nearly walk you through the entire
mystery that Steiner understood, as Christ commanding, obviously
commanding matter.
Magdalene saw the first shimmering Rainbow/matter
- crystalization, sensitive christialization process, as that
which we never witness, when the butterfly arises with the magnificent
shimmering colors on her wings. Magdalene had the front row seat,
as matter, color, and the Elohim - Spirit Man mystery began shimmering
into solidity as the atomic table congealed before Magdalene's
eyes. "Touch Me Not" If we only had real Anthro's who
really stood firmly and understood the meaning of what was just
said, Science would leap forward. Do we even have 100 Anthros
stunned by what they read in Steiner?
Bradford adds;
Alright, hold onto your seats. I rather need
no proof and I doubt anything could be supplied to prove what
I absolutely understand in my own I AM cognition regarding the
Elohim of the Christ and Master of the fallen atomic table. This
is clear to me, perhaps after long study, but we should be standing
on this by now. We should know this. But Let us look at a related
Matter, IMprinting, and Organizing icon, treasured by superstitious
souls, where as the Spiritual Cognition of Marie Corelli and
Dr. Steiner work well for me.
Get this, Imprinting the Atomic organization
of matter, why is this so hard to understand? What super-heated,
contained Father God fission was going on in that tomb? This
is the Michael School and we certainly don't need the Shroud
of Turin for back up.
[long link]
"The Shroud of Turin
Research Project spent 120 hours examining the cloth in minute
detail but was unable to explain how the image had got there.
Barrie Schwortz, the project's photographer, says: "We did
absolutely every test there was to try to find out how that image
had got there.
"We used X-rays, ultra-violet
light, spectral imaging and photographed every inch of it in
the most minute detail, but we still couldn't come up with any
answers.
"We weren't a bunch of
amateurs. We had scientists who had worked on the first atomic
bomb and the space programme, yet we still couldn't say how the
image got there. The only things we could say was what it isn't:
that it isn't a photograph and it wasn't a painting.
"It's clear that there
has been a direct contact between the shroud and a body, which
explains certain features such as the blood, but science just
doesn't have an answer of how the image of that body got on to
it."
A SECOND study was carried
out in 1988, when scientists cut a sliver from the edge of the
shroud and subjected it to carbon-dating.
Carbon has a fixed rate of
decay, which means that it is possible to accurately measure
when the plant materials that formed the basis of the cloth were
harvested.
The announcement that the
shroud was a fake was made on October 13, 1988, at the British
Museum. Scientists compared those who still thought the shroud
was authentic to flat-earthers.
It led to the humiliating
spectacle of the then Cardinal of Turin, Anastasio Alberto Ballestrero,
admitting the garment was a hoax.
The Catholic Church also accepted
the scientists' findings - an embarrassing admission given that
Pope John Paul II had kissed the shroud eight years earlier.
But experts now say the carbon-dating
results are wrong. Ian Wilson, co-author of The Turin Shroud:
Unshrouding The Mystery, says they were flawed from the moment
the sample was taken.
He says: "What I found
quite incredible was that when they had all the scientists there
and ready to go, an argument started about where the sample would
come from.
"This went on for some
considerable time before a very bad decision was made that the
cutting would come from a corner that we know was used for holding
up the shroud and which would have been more contaminated than
anywhere else."
Marc Guscin, author of Burial
Cloths Of Christ, believes the most compelling evidence for the
shroud's authenticity comes from a small, blood-soaked cloth
kept in a cathedral in Oviedo, northern Spain.
The Sudarium is believed to
have been used to cover Jesus's head after he died and, unlike
the shroud, its history has been traced back to the first century.
It contains blood from the rare AB group found on the shroud.
Mark says: "Laboratory
tests have shown that these two cloths were used on the same
body."
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