The Sky People

From: golden3000997
Date: Thu Nov 27, 2003 10:32 am
Subject: The Sky People

Hello Everyone,

I uploaded my "Native American" stories to a file in our group called "Christine". I hope that you enjoy them.

They were created for my Kindergarten children, trying to put various Native American stories into a form more accessible for young children. Many Native American stories are quite adult, or suited for older children.

While I'm at it, I'll add my story "The Golden Soldier" written for Michaelmas (early grades).

: ) Christine

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From: Joel Wendt
Date: Thu Nov 27, 2003 12:50 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] The Sky People

Dear Christine,

I have a dear friend who is a Mohawk healer and shamaness. To her the term Sky People refers to something that can be experienced directly, in much the same way anthroposophists might use the term "spiritual world". Contact with the Sky People is a product of Native American initiation (my term).

This contact appears to be telepathic in nature - questions put and answers received. The Sky People includes ancestors, and this same "source" also provides a medium of contact among individual Native American "initiates", belonging to different Nations. Higher beings also belong to this realm, who have names similar to the various stories within each tradition.

There were some indications among those who I studied with in Fair Oaks, in the circle around Carl Stegmann, that the Great Spirit of Native American tradition, was an ahrimanic being. I don't know this for a fact, but later research suggests this may be true only from a certain point of view, and then from another, it is not true.

My friend, for example, who on a monthly basis performed productive "healing circles" in her home (until her own illness cycles prevented her from continuing), always told those who came (this was done for free, and by word of mouth - no advertising or anything) that she was not the one who healed them, but rather it was the Christ. In addition she explained to me, and in the circle, that on certain occasions she perceived Christ in the form of an angel when these circles (which were more than simple ceremonies) were conducted.

Their system of initiation seems arrested at the stage of what in the Tarot is called the Hanged Man. It basically involves a sacrifice of the will to the celestial center of gravity (see Meditations on the Tarot: a journey into Christian Hermeticism). My friend is fiercely strong willed, and has a most unusual biography. She takes most questions we would consider individual moral questions (needing us to engage in moral imagination) to the Sky People. Her faith in this source and her own traditions is like granite. Yet, paradoxically, her prime moral question, the one that guides her every action is: What is the next most loving thing that I can do? This she answers herself.

Living out of this question has led her to actions, from which most of us would shirk. Just a small example - she teaches in a community college where she is head of the combined social work and psychology departments, giving of herself to all manner of unusual students that would otherwise never see higher education (mentally ill people, former convicts, many many poor).

Anglos (her name for white people) have a hard time finding out these things, or getting any training, because we are basically not trusted in the beginning. One needs to spend years getting to know a particular shaman, who really is looking almost solely at character development, with little or no interest in what you think. The essential criteria seems to be what you have willed yourself to be as an upright person, and intellectual learning has no real meaning at all.

A friend of mine in the Southwest has been making contacts for years, and his acceptance in certain Native circles seems entirely based upon his long silence, with just a lot of listening. There are also quite necessary ways of bringing small gifts (American Spirit tobacco is a good one), which are seen as a token of honor and respect. Us Anglos with all our questions and hungers for the spirit seem way to impatient to be imparted anything of real value.

I was told, in about 1985, the following remarkable story by an acquaintance in Fair Oaks, who was half Cherokee and half Anglo. After many years, she was finally allowed into a certain ceremony, which was carried out in Cherokee. At several places in the ceremony she heard, surprisingly, the seemingly English word "Christ". She asked the shaman later, what that was about, and the answer she reported to me was as follows: "We have always known there was an Earth Spirit. Now we know His Name."

warm regards,
joel

On Thu, 2003-11-27 at 11:32, golden3000997 wrote:

Hello Everyone,

I uploaded my "Native American" stories to a file in our group called "Christine". I hope that you enjoy them.

They were created for my Kindergarten children, trying to put various Native American stories into a form more accessible for young children. Many Native American stories are quite adult, or suited for older children.

While I'm at it, I'll add my story "The Golden Soldier" written for Michaelmas (early grades).

: ) Christine


--
Joel Wendt

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From: Gisele
Date: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:03 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] The Sky People

Hi Christine, thanks for this! I am very fond of Native American lore, and it is a pleasure to find these stories on an 'Anthropop' list. Where are you teaching? (Meaning: in what continent are you? - me, I write from Britain).

Cheers

Gisele

golden3000997 wrote:

Hello Everyone,

I uploaded my "Native American" stories to a file in our group called "Christine". I hope that you enjoy them.

They were created for my Kindergarten children, trying to put various Native American stories into a form more accessible for young children. Many Native American stories are quite adult, or suited for older children.

While I'm at it, I'll add my story "The Golden Soldier" written for Michaelmas (early grades).

: ) Christine

.............................................................................................................................

From: golden3000997
Date: Sat Nov 29, 2003 7:23 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] The Sky People

Hello again, Giselle,

I am in Miami, FL (since 1988) I haven't been teaching for about 10 years, but I hope to go back to it someday soon, if I can find anyone who will have me.

I'm a difficult case.

What part of Britain are you in? Welcome to the group.

: ) Christine

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From: Gisele
Date: Tue Dec 2, 2003 2:17 pm
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] The Sky People

golden3000997 wrote:

Hello again, Giselle,

I am in Miami, FL (since 1988) I haven't been teaching for about 10 years,
but I hope to go back to it someday soon, if I can find anyone who will have me.

I'm a difficult case.

~~~~:-) are you now? Eh eh, it canbe difficult.... Were you in waldorf? I did the training for upper class, but never finished. Anyway, I am working with 'difficult' teen agers now, even without that qualification. It looks like karma can catch up with us in funny ways sometimes. How I actually landed at 43 in a similar job to the one I felt as a vocation when I was twenty is a strange adventure indeed

What part of Britain are you in? Welcome to the group.

~~~~I am in London

Gix

: ) Christine

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From: golden3000997
Date: Sat Nov 29, 2003 8:31 pm
Subject: Response re: Sky People

I am responding new, due to the length of Joel's message and my idiocy when it comes to snipping these e-mails.

Thank you, Joel for the response, even though it seems like just a response to the title, you didn't say anything about the story itself.

I was in Fair Oaks and knew Carl and Christine Stegmann briefly. Christine was our Eurythmy teacher in our teacher training. It was 77-78, the first year that Rene and Merlyn Querido came to Fair Oaks. I have started "The Other America" by Carl Stegmann, but I haven't finished it or studied it. I've got it right here, though and I'll get there! The starting point for me, though is "Respect for Life" and "Can the Red Man Help the White Man" two books that record the conversations with Dr. Franz Winkler and others of the Myrin Institute with representative leaders of various Native American tribes. These conversations plant some really remarkable seeds for further study and discussion.

Joel wrote

There were some indications among those who I studied with in Fair Oaks, in the circle around Carl Stegmann, that the Great Spirit of Native American tradition, was an ahrimanic being. I don't know this for a fact, but later research suggests this may be true only from a certain point of view, and then from another, it is not true.

I think we have to be very, very careful about associating Native American spiritual culture with Arhiman. They couldn't have been any more any Arhimanic than European culture, that's absolutely a fact!! (Ancient Myths and the New Isis Mystery Dornach 24th of December 1920 included at the end of seven lectures given Jan 4 - 17, 1918.)

What I have come across re Steiner is that the forces in the West were deeply connected with the impulse of Saturn, the planet of Chronos, of Time. Deep ages of time. Of course, if you consider the Atlantean exodus, with Manu, or Noah sailing to the East and two "black magic" streams sailing to the West, we have something that also has to be spoken about carefully and respectfully. For me, personally, I never want to set one foot in Mexico and I'm not crazy about Central and South America either. I have friends and acquaintances from all of those countries, especially Peru, and I might make an exception for Peru. I think there was some light preserved on those high, high reaches of Machu Piccu. And I read about the Mayan culture constantly. Please understand me. I am not trying to be critical, this is very, very personal. I am "land sensitive". I have felt powerful vibes in different places that I have lived in this lifetime (all US so far) - both good and bad. But I sense a dark force from Mexico down that really frightens me. I don't sense that in the US and Canada. I have driven across this country twice, once on a northern route from East to West and once on a southern route from West to East. I have traveled up and down the East Coast many times and up and down the West Coast from British Columbia to Sacramento and San Francisco many times. I have felt very negative vibes in certain places that other people consider "beautiful." And some very healing vibes in unexpected places.

All this is to say that my understanding of "black magic" in terms of the Atlantean mysteries has absolutely nothing to do with the Native American people of today or a few hundred years ago, or even with the native cultures (what remain of them) in Central and South American. But the land remembers. I feel often as if the land we walk on is like a mirror, just a sheet of glass with something under it which hides from our vision the reality beneath. And the reality is the "pool of blood" the awful karma of genocide in the West. I am an Atlantean, myself. I can say that with certainty because I am not usually given to clairvoyance and yet, I have had a powerful experience of myself there which I could see, hear and feel on all levels. Plus, I have always "tuned in" whenever I heard the word Atlantis. As a very young girl, I had "disaster" fantasies in which I had to survive and help others survive. I have been here many times since, I'm not one of those who have held back, but I still feel connected with the "oh no, not again!" impulse. Like, when are we going to LEARN?

My feeling so far about the Native North Americans (Mexico & above) is that it is spiritually speaking, something from Atlantis but impregnated (so to speak) with an impulse that continued to move EASTWARD from India over the Bering Straits land bridge. Maybe it is more strongly connected with the Noah impulse than the South American impulse. Maybe the word "Indian" is spiritually speaking correct - that the people who lived for so long "isolated" from the stream of Western European development are at least in part really from India or at least the Ancient Indian, First Post Atlantean culture and they were kept away from Western civilization in order to protect forces that we (all of humanity) would need at a future stage of development (maybe today)? Everywhere that I have been reading about Ancient Myths and Mystery Schools, Steiner is always and exclusively and specifically speaking of those mystery streams out of Atlantis that went into the East and re-migrated West toward Europe through Ancient India, Ancient Persia, Ancient Egypt, Babylon/Chaldea and Ancient Greece. He is very very specific about these streams, the Saturn, Jupiter and Mars schools as "opposed" in a way to the Sun, Mercury, Venus and Moon schools. But every reference, general and specific that I have been able to find so far is to the Atlantis - East - then West (Europe). I am still seeking something specifically related to Atlantis - West or Atlantis - East - MORE East over the Bering Straights to this continent. (I have a feeling that there is a difference from Atlantis - West/ South, like I said above.)

What good may be salvaged from the brutal introduction of European "civilization" onto this land may be that there is still an impulse carried in the tribal people who have survived, something that is more than atavistic clairvoyance. Perhaps there is a seed, not just a remnant, that has been carefully guarded. As I said in an earlier post, I don't personally believe that the "introduction" between the European culture and the North American culture had to be so brutal and bloody. I also don't believe that the introduction of African culture to this continent had to be so either. But what's done is done and we have to live with the consequences. Now for the redemption. To bring these cultures together in such a way that they can retain the individuality born of experience, while all break free of mere bloodline tradition; to weave together the life lines to form a bigger picture, one more complete. To write off what any culture has to offer to today's world simply because it is an ancient one is a mistake which European people have been making for far too long.

Still searching,
Christine

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From: Joel Wendt
Date: Sun Nov 30, 2003 10:35 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Response re: Sky People

Dear Christine,

Given what you said below you might want to read some stuff on my website.

First, Stephen Clarke's researches at http://ipwebdev.com/hermit/clarke4.html

And then perhaps, my vision of the real meaning of the meeting between the new Sun mysteries (Anthroposophy) and the Saturn mysteries in America: The Mystery of the True White Brother - an interpretation of the Hopi Prophecy by a member of the Elder Brother People, at: http://ipwebdev.com/hermit/eldbr.html

warm regards,
joel

On Sat, 2003-11-29 at 21:31, golden3000997 wrote:
I am responding new, due to the length of Joel's message and my idiocy when it comes to snipping these e-mails.

Thank you, Joel for the response, even though it seems like just a response to the title, you didn't say anything about the story itself.

<snip>

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From: golden3000997
Date: Sun Nov 30, 2003 10:51 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Response re: Sky People

OOOO, OOOO , OOOO!!!!! COOOOOLLLLL!!!!

From Joel's website:

Metropolis: Fritz Lang, director. 1927 cinematic milestone. Forget the thrice-edited and thoroughly botched, out-of-focus 1998 Hollywood Classics edition; get the version recently released and now available from www.kino.com/metropolis, restored and refurbished (1,300' of film added since the last release in 1987) with loving care by Martin Koerber and Alpha-Omega.

From A. O. Scott, N. Y. Times film reviewer (Fri., July 12, 2002): “The story of the scientist Rotwang, a modern Pygmalion designing a female robot to replace his lost love, stands between “Frankenstein” and “A. I.” as an expression of the defining modern preoccupation with machines that blur the boundary between the human and the mechanical.”

It's all about Threefold Man!!! with the True Maria and the False Maria ! Oh it it just way, way cool!!

OK, Ok , I scolled all the way down - just superficial to the core, I guess - but I was going to bring up Metropolis. I was just thinking about it today!!! Isn't it terrific stuff?? : )

Oh, the whole book online seems to be just what I have been looking for.
Thank you!!

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From: golden3000997
Date: Sun Nov 30, 2003 11:29 am
Subject: The Roerich Pact & the Pax Cultura Banner

To all, but esp. Joel re the Hopi prophecy & symbol from the East (Russia)

I never knew about this until recently on one of my seredipitous ramblings through the internet.

http://www.roerich.org/

follow his biography to the Roerich Pact and the symbol is at the top. I will post in in my photo file because I can't attach it directly to this e-mail.

Let me know what you think. Did you know about this before? I didn't!
: ) Christine

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